In our latest episode of Conversations on Wealth, Sarah Widmeyer, SVP, Head of Wealth Strategies, chats with Natalie Bisset, SVP, Head of Corporate Development about how the wealth management landscape is evolving as women prepare to control nearly half of Canadian wealth by 2026.
Sarah and Natalie talk about how female investors want their investments to influence social change, the importance of a holistic wealth plan that considers the variable journey of a woman’s life, and how careers in wealth management can allow for more autonomy for women.
Sarah Widmeyer 00:16
Welcome to Conversations on Wealth, a podcast dedicated to helping Canadians navigate the complexities of wealth with a multi-dimensional approach to planning and wealth management. I’m Sarah Widmeyer, SVP and Head of Wealth Strategies at Richardson Wealth, and today we’re talking about one of my most favourite topics. We’re talking about women and wealth, and something called the great wealth transfer. If you haven’t heard this term before, it’s based on this statistic: by 2026, women are expected to oversee nearly half of Canadian wealth. Traditionally, women have tended to be overlooked in wealth conversations. But that’s quickly changing. Women are no longer just a niche market. And here today to talk to me about what that means for the wealth industry is my dear colleague, Natalie Bisset, Head of Corporate Development at Richardson Wealth. Welcome, Natalie.
Natalie Bisset 01:18
Thank you for having me, Sarah.
Sarah Widmeyer 01:21
So Natalie, we’re here today to talk about women and wealth, and it is a subject that is so close and dear to both of us. In my opening comments, I talked about the fact that women are becoming the primary holders of wealth, and what I’d like you to talk about, before we get going into some of the questions I have ready for you, is this massive shift in wealth. I guess I want to know about why is it happening? And why is it happening now?
Natalie Bisset 01:57
You and I have talked a little bit about this before. And we know that there are major demographics that play. Women stand to inherit twice, once from parents and a second time possibly from partners. The other element that’s critically important when we think about “where is this wealth coming from?…” Women are starting to generate more of their own wealth.
Sarah Widmeyer 02:19
I love that. Women are becoming, I think, you would know this, Natalie, that women are becoming–they’re taking a greater share of post-secondary education than men even. We’re pursuing that higher level of education.
Natalie Bisset 02:35
I heard a statistic recently that was more than 50% of law school students were women.
Sarah Widmeyer 02:41
Yeah.
Natalie Bisset 02:42
So to your point, absolutely, and we’re seeing that demographic shift.
Sarah Widmeyer 02:46
Yeah.
Natalie Bisset 02:46
So then you take that out, you know, 5, 10, 15, 20 years… And here we are women in positions of leadership, so recent statistics are that 33% of leadership roles in North America are now held by women.
Sarah Widmeyer 03:02
Wow. That I didn’t realize that. That’s a new one for me. So now when we shift to wealth management, because obviously this is going to have a massive shift on wealth management that has traditionally been geared towards the male as the primary income holder and the primary decider around wealth management decisions. So we think about women for a minute, women are more likely than men to experience life changes and career changes. We are the ones that tend to and speaking in massive generalizations, because I know that a lot of men that do take parental leave, but women tend to be the primary takers of that maternity leave. And we also tend to take time off to care for aging parents, that whole sandwich, we’re the meat in the sandwich. So that has to have an impact on long term–thinking around investing and goals. And the caregiving thing as well–you talk about women taking on higher levels of management and careers. There’s still a gender pay gap, sadly.
Natalie Bisset 04:11
Yes.
Sarah Widmeyer 04:11
And that gender pay gap only gets amplified when we take the time off to care for children and then for aging parents. So not only are we, again, huge generalization, making less, we’re taking time off, so we’ve got less time to save for retirement and to build up that investment–egg.
Natalie Bisset 04:37
Absolutely, and that’s why holistic wealth planning needs to take that into consideration. And wealth managers need to understand those key elements as they think about the more variable journey that a woman’s life takes, and when it comes to wealth planning overall so taking into account the gender pay gap, taking into account caregiving that might take us out of the workforce for periods of time. A quality wealth plan will help not just women, but families navigate the ups and downs of those moments in time, and with less stress. So you think about a recent journey for you and your family and caregiving needs in your own personal life. With an impactful plan that helps you navigate that, let you know that you’re going to be okay, you’re going to be able to achieve your goals, what a gift to your family,
Sarah Widmeyer 05:34
Yeah
Natalie Bisset 05:34
and for your peace of mind while you’re focused on that critical role of caregiving.
Sarah Widmeyer 05:40
Yeah, yeah, well, said. So… taking that thread and pushing it a little further, research shows that women tend to approach investing with more holistic views, and they really do think about the impact on their families and communities. Can you talk about the relationship with an advisor and why it’s so important for a wealth advisor to understand these, I would say unique perspectives?
Natalie Bisset 06:08
Absolutely. Again, it’s a bit of a generalization, because it applies to all genders, having an impact with your wealth, and putting that wealth to work, to advance social initiatives, and to benefit community as a whole is critically important. And women tend to think a little differently about how to employ wealth. And when it comes to investing with a holistic view, they are thinking about community in mind. And when we’re talking about wealth planning, and involving women in that conversation, women make other essential decisions around family health care, travel, house purchases, car purchases, major, big ticket decisions typically are made by women.
Sarah Widmeyer 07:04
Right.
Sarah Widmeyer 07:04
Right.
Natalie Bisset 07:04
So why, why historically has the conversation around wealth not involved the women who are the decision makers around some of these pretty big goals or spending opportunities that impact their finances? So when it comes to impact investing, and having a holistic view, it’s essential that we think about the relationship between the female client and the female advisor to help advance those goals.
Natalie Bisset 07:10
You’re thinking about the emotional management of money, rather than “this is the investment I’m selecting for you today.”
Sarah Widmeyer 07:41
Right, right.
Natalie Bisset 07:42
You’re thinking about that whole basket.
Sarah Widmeyer 07:45
And I know we’re going to talk about impact investing in a moment, but that whole concept of “women tend to want to do well by doing good.” And there really is a consideration, I think, paid by women to what the money is for and where it’s going and how it’s helping everybody–themselves, their investment returns, their families, but the community around them.
Sarah Widmeyer 08:10
Well, one of the rabbit holes I went down a couple of years ago is understanding the differences between how women and men communicate around money. You know, there’s a perception that we don’t want to talk about risk, or that we’re very price adverse, and it’s not that we’re risk averse is that we need to understand the benefit. So to your point, it’s about listening and understanding the questions and then taking the time to really explain it in a way–in a language that makes sense. So a woman asking about how much something would cost to do an investment plan or investment strategies is not a woman throwing up an objection to that, it’s just for greater understanding, and she may just simply not understand, it’s not that she’s not willing to pay. Women pay for all sorts of expensive things like Louis Vuitton purses,
Natalie Bisset 08:10
Yes.
Natalie Bisset 08:35
(Laughs in agreement)
Sarah Widmeyer 08:54
it’s understanding the value of what they’re getting for the price that’s paid. And that listening is so critical to establishing trust because listening comes understanding and understanding therefore, creates trust.
Natalie Bisset 09:21
Absolutely. And building on that is the research shows that women are willing to pay more for the same service if it’s provided by someone that they trust more.
Sarah Widmeyer 09:31
Yeah
Natalie Bisset 09:31
So that’s another critical piece as you think about wealth management and women,
Sarah Widmeyer 09:36
Yeah
Natalie Bisset 09:37
trust is at the core, and they’re willing to pay more for your services. So you highlighted Sarah, how it’s really important for people to understand the service that you’re providing. But it ties so strongly to the willingness to pay for it as well.
Sarah Widmeyer 09:48
Yeah, yeah.
Natalie Bisset 09:49
And that leads into to another element of building trust, and that’s making commitments whether or not they might be wealth planning goals or objectives or it’s even in client communications, part of building trust requires us to set goals or expectations, and then meet them.
Sarah Widmeyer 10:07
Right
Natalie Bisset 10:08
How novel.
Sarah Widmeyer 10:09
Right
Natalie Bisset 10:09
Right?
Sarah Widmeyer 10:10
Right
Natalie Bisset 10:10
I say I’m going to call you on Tuesday, I will call you on Tuesday. That is another core component of creating and building trust. So when you think about that, for a wealth manager, it means creating systems, processes, thinking about the holistic relationship.
Sarah Widmeyer 10:26
Yeah.
Natalie Bisset 10:26
Which is something that women excel at.
Sarah Widmeyer 10:28
Yeah, yeah. And I was just thinking about as you were talking, and I’m thinking about the whole listening comment, and I’m gonna get this wrong, but I’m going to stagger through it “that we have two ears, two eyes, and one mouth, use it in that ratio”. So make sure that you’re really truly listening to your clients. And it’s not a traditional role that investment advisors play, we like to tell, we like to tell someone why they should be doing something or tell them why they shouldn’t be doing something or tell them how smart we are, and how fortunate we are that our clients are dealing with us because we have all this knowledge and education and credibility. But the best conversations are when I think we are more quiet, and we let the clients talk. And they come away thinking, wow, that was an amazing meeting. And meanwhile, the advisor really didn’t say a whole lot. Those are some of the best meetings, I think, especially when we’re talking about women as clients.
Natalie Bisset 11:26
I love that Sarah, and it’s providing this space where you’ve created trust, you’ve created an opportunity to share openly, because you can’t get to some core goals if you’re not willing to share, you know, actually, I’m really worried about my spouse passing away before I do.
Sarah Widmeyer 11:26
Yeah, yeah!
Natalie Bisset 11:28
And getting into those emotional conversations requires that you feel safe, heard,
Sarah Widmeyer 11:48
Yeah.
Natalie Bisset 11:49
and that you trust the person you’re you’re sharing this information with.
Sarah Widmeyer 11:52
Yeah.
Natalie Bisset 11:52
We’ve heard so many stories about clients sharing very interesting, highly confidential, sometimes bizarre situations in their personal life with their advisor. I heard a funny story last week that a client called an advisor and said, I want to buy a car. And that wasn’t the question. How does this fit into my plan? It’s Sarah, “what colour car should I buy?”
Sarah Widmeyer 12:14
(Laughs)
Natalie Bisset 12:14
It just… It highlights how important these advisors are not just for wealth, but in life.
Sarah Widmeyer 12:21
That’s right.
Natalie Bisset 12:21
Right? And it’s a pretty interesting and unique opportunity.
Sarah Widmeyer 12:25
Yeah.
Natalie Bisset 12:25
And so you think about the role as a wealth manager…
Sarah Widmeyer 12:28
Yeah.
Natalie Bisset 12:29
What a privilege.
Sarah Widmeyer 12:30
Yeah
Sarah Widmeyer 12:31
Yeah. Yeah. And I think one of the other things that in, in the research that I did that is so I think critical to the male advisors listening is that, at least in my research, it’s not that women want to deal only with a woman advisor. It’s actually an equal opportunity sport. Men are equally great at it. It’s about the skills. And it’s the skills that we’re talking about. It’s creating that trusted, safe space, where you’re listening to your client talk about their hopes, dreams, fears, or their car choice colours. (Laughs) It’s that–that’s the secret sauce. It’s not about the fact that I’m a woman and a woman can only deal with other women.
Natalie Bisset 12:33
that is.
Sarah Widmeyer 12:40
It’s, it’s really about creating that, that safe space. And I know the other neat thing, and maybe you could talk about this for a moment, but that when advisors are building their book, they’re looking for client referrals. And women are great sources of referrals. Want to talk about that for a moment?
Natalie Bisset 13:36
I’d love to. We love to share the things that we adore and enjoy using and the people that we love engaging with, with our friends. It’s part of building community. And you think about major moments in time as a parent, as a child at school, as you’re entering the workforce, you want to share stories with other people who are going through similar journeys.
Sarah Widmeyer 14:01
Yeah
Natalie Bisset 14:01
So as a new parent, it’s a–you know, is this a great stroller to buy, you know, I–I, what kind of carrier do I get? What’s the safest car seat, and you share the information–as a young person considering where they might go to school post-secondary. You talked to your friends, oh, I went to this school, you wouldn’t believe the student union building and all the services that they have there. Do you know this one has a rock climbing wall? Then you think about the new career entrant? They talked to their network? Is this really a good place to work? Sarah, what was your experience? You know, your first year working in finance… did it feel exciting, daunting, where were the best sources for learning? That is an inherent part of how we build community.
Sarah Widmeyer 14:48
Mmhmm
Natalie Bisset 14:48
And there’s tremendous opportunity for us to share insights, create referral sources for our clients. When we think about the unique journey that they’re going through… how can we be highest and best use, and it goes back to something you said earlier. Know the service that you’re paying for. It goes so much beyond what investment choices that you’re making, it goes to the overall holistic wealth management experience, which means, do I have a great contractor to refer you to? You know, it’s part of your financial goal that you want to build a cottage. That’s just one small example, and that provides a more impactful experience for your clients because they already trust you.
Sarah Widmeyer 15:32
That’s right. That’s right. Okay, so I’m going to change topics a little bit, still talking about women. But I want to talk about impact investing. And I know this is something that is close to your heart. So um, I want to talk about this for a moment. Recent data shows us that female investors are looking for impact investing, it goes back to what I said earlier about, we want to do well, while we are doing good. Can you talk about that for a moment?
Natalie Bisset 16:02
Absolutely. Women are playing a pivotal role in this movement. And as of five years ago, the impact investing market in Canada was 20 billion dollars.
Sarah Widmeyer 16:13
Wow.
Natalie Bisset 16:14
…which is incredible, and that’s been growing, right.
Sarah Widmeyer 16:16
Yeah
Natalie Bisset 16:17
And so women have an opportunity to prioritize investments that generate positive social and environmental outcomes, alongside financial terms, as you so eloquently highlighted. And as you think about this great wealth transfer, this is a unique moment in history where we can use our wealth to progress social change
Sarah Widmeyer 16:37
Mmhmm
Natalie Bisset 16:37
We can back organizations, companies, founders, that are providing services that benefit women in more diverse groups. And you’re right, it is a topic close to my heart, having been a co-founder of a mobile health startup company, my co-founder and I wanted to create a healthier journey for women going through pregnancy.
Sarah Widmeyer 17:00
Okay
Natalie Bisset 17:01
So there is an altruistic element to that. And when I navigated the capital raising journey, what I found is that very true to the statistics that 6% of venture capital were going to women, I found how challenging it was to sell a product.
Sarah Widmeyer 17:18
So hold on… 6% of 100% 6%.
Natalie Bisset 17:22
Yes.
Sarah Widmeyer 17:22
…of 100%.
Natalie Bisset 17:23
That’s right… goes to.
Sarah Widmeyer 17:25
So 94%.
Natalie Bisset 17:26
Yes.
Sarah Widmeyer 17:27
Go to men.
Natalie Bisset 17:29
Yes.
Sarah Widmeyer 17:29
Okay.
Natalie Bisset 17:30
So if you think about companies that are founded by women, with a unique perspective, and possibly services that are being sold to women, they are not getting the same funding, they’re not getting the same mentorship, coaching and support, potentially. And this is a significant opportunity in history to use the wealth to back companies that are diversity owned.
Sarah Widmeyer 17:58
Hmm
Natalie Bisset 17:59
So here’s another part of it if you think about the next layer. When you have a more diverse investor base, we are more willing to think about other journeys. And I shared a little bit about my background, we were called a niche product.
Sarah Widmeyer 18:15
Hmmm
Natalie Bisset 18:16
Every single new human
Sarah Widmeyer 18:19
(Laughs)
Natalie Bisset 18:19
has a benefit to-to–ha-could benefit from this product… I’ll…
Sarah Widmeyer 18:23
But yet you’re niche
Natalie Bisset 18:25
It–niche.
Sarah Widmeyer 18:25
Wow.
Natalie Bisset 18:26
So it opened up my eyes. And that’s part of the reason it became such an area of interest for me–
Sarah Widmeyer 18:31
Mmhmm
Natalie Bisset 18:31
is because I started to see the light, and how important it was to bring more people to the table to support, coach, mentor and invest in businesses that were diversity owned, because they had an opportunity to positively affect those populations.
Sarah Widmeyer 18:50
Mmhmm
Natalie Bisset 18:51
And it is improving and I–it warms my heart when I see angel investment networks that are supporting women, specifically, and funding that’s going to women. So there’s a lot more that has changed in the last five to 10 years that’s benefiting
Sarah Widmeyer 19:06
Mmhmm
Natalie Bisset 19:06
more diverse founders. But when we think about impact investing overall, this is a tremendous opportunity for us.
Sarah Widmeyer 19:13
Yeah, it really is. So this kind of takes us into wealth management then. So how is this wealth shift, and perhaps different perspectives on wealth and different perspectives on goals and things we want to achieve with our wealth? How is that creating opportunities for women to consider a career in wealth management? What qualities do women bring to these roles, and why do female advisors and female clients, and I know I had said earlier it really is an equal opportunity sport, and I really do believe it is, however, I know that there’s a huge opportunity for women to come into this industry because we’re just so natural at some of the skills that we’ve talked about. So how to female clients and female advisors make great investing partners?
Natalie Bisset 20:06
I love this topic, there is an incredible benefit that comes from women working with each other as investing partners. And importantly, tying it back to what we were just speaking about with impact investing 84% of female investors are interested in sustainable investing options compared to 67% of male investors. So as we think about that as one trend, it’s important that as women work together as partners, that they’re actually supporting and amplifying this impact investing opportunity. So as we think about the opportunity for women to work together, it’s important to know some other information, which is that research shows diverse teams including women are more effective at managing wealth and delivering better results for clients. So it’s probably maybe a decade or two ago that many women weren’t involved in the conversation. So an advisor having a meeting, a family meeting with clients, so Mr. And Mrs. Smith, quite frequently, I heard stories about how it would only be Mr. Smith, where the advisors (were) speaking directly to the male client.
Sarah Widmeyer 21:22
That’s right.
Natalie Bisset 21:23
This created a couple of downsides, I’m sure we can think of many, but by women not being at the table, they were not receiving the education, not receiving the comfort, also not having the opportunity to direct how their wealth was being managed.
Sarah Widmeyer 21:39
Mmhmm
Natalie Bisset 21:41
So with that shifting, and more women being involved in wealth management, more women inheriting wealth, and now getting to be at the table, this is a pretty interesting opportunity to create stronger relationships.
Sarah Widmeyer 21:55
Yeah, yeah. And you know what, as you’re talking about it, I’m thinking about, okay, so think about that situation where the male in the family is being spoken to by the investment advisor, and the female is remaining quiet. And now think about the demographics that that woman is likely inheriting twice. So now she has all the family eggs in her basket. What does she do with that? Does she then turn back to that advisor who ignored her for the last 25 years? Or does she go ask her girlfriend “”Who do you deal with?
Natalie Bisset 22:28
Absolutely. And you and I have had some interesting and intriguing conversations before about the data around the number of women that leave an advisor when they lose a spouse.
Sarah Widmeyer 22:39
That’s right…
Natalie Bisset 22:39
And you’re absolutely right, Sarah, if they haven’t built that trust that we talked about earlier, they haven’t involved them in the conversation, and an advisor hasn’t tailored the messaging for the right audience to make sure that she felt included and heard, they’re not at the table when she’s considering who do I move forward with?
Sarah Widmeyer 22:56
No, no. So you know, there’s a lot of focus in our industry about, you know, the next generation and making sure that we’re, you know, developing marketing strategies and ways to meet and understand the needs of the next generation. And that’s all really important and really good. But the woman gets the money first. And so that’s where the attention really should be focused… first, in my view, my humble view.
Natalie Bisset 23:26
I agree with you.
Sarah Widmeyer 23:28
(Laughs)
Natalie Bisset 23:28
And regardless of who’s at the table, men, women, other advisors and wealth managers should always be including the key stakeholders in the conversation. And I think that’s what I’ve been hearing from advisors and clients alike, how that experience is changing.
Sarah Widmeyer 23:47
Yeah
Natalie Bisset 23:47
And I personally believe part of that is driven out of the wealth planning conversations.
Sarah Widmeyer 23:52
Yes.
Natalie Bisset 23:53
You can’t talk about the entire wealth plan. And what happens after one partner passes away…
Sarah Widmeyer 24:00
Yeah. Yeah.
Natalie Bisset 24:00
If you don’t have the remaining spouse at the table to talk about “what do you want to do with that money?”
Sarah Widmeyer 24:05
Yeah.
Natalie Bisset 24:05
And before something happens, do you think about philanthropy? Do you think about giving to your family and other people that are going to inherit from you while you’re living?
Sarah Widmeyer 24:16
I know. I think about my parents who never spoke about wealth, never spoke about the money never spoke about where anything was
Sarah Widmeyer 24:25
It was taboo, and how that’s changed with my family now with my daughters. It’s not that we’re including them in decisions about who gets what, but we are being more transparent about what we’re building. And we are more transparent about our intentions about the wealth and the nest egg that we’re creating for them, and frankly, for our community. And I think that is another turn in wealth and I think women are a big part of that. I think women being at the table discussing, you know, preparing the next generation for wealth, preparing themselves for wealth. What’s the money for? What are our views on money? What are our views on our community and giving back? I think those are family discussions. And I think women are in many cases at the head of that ship, making sure that those conversations are happening more transparently.
Natalie Bisset 24:26
Taboo
Natalie Bisset 24:49
And what you’re providing your daughters and many others are doing the same, is that we’re increasing financial literacy. And by removing the taboo nature of the topic, we are giving the next generation an open space to ask questions.
Sarah Widmeyer 25:36
Right.
Natalie Bisset 25:37
And for them to learn a lot more at points in time when, I’m not gonna say it doesn’t matter as much. But the risk is lower, right? If you’re, you know, you’ve got a $500 credit card, and you talk to them about managing debt then, versus trying to get into the housing market, and they’re looking at downtown Toronto, you’re looking at one and a half million dollars and massive debt from a mortgage, so much better to create the understanding around managing debt at a younger age when the risk factors are smaller.
Sarah Widmeyer 26:05
Right. Right. So well said.
Sarah Widmeyer 26:19
Well, we could go on and on, and perhaps we should in another conversation. So consider yourself invited to come back to talk about this again.
Natalie Bisset 26:29
Thank you, Sarah.
Sarah Widmeyer 26:29
But while we have you today, is there anything else you’d like to share?
Natalie Bisset 26:33
I’d love to tap back into something you said earlier about the gender pay gap. And you were referring to it in the context of why it’s so important to have planning, because, aside from the caregiving responsibilities, the fact that we earn less over time, it’s an important thing to understand as we navigate that journey. It’s also important when we think about a career in wealth management.
Natalie Bisset 26:55
Right? There’s all sorts of research and theories about why there is still a gender pay gap, that gap widens, so it’s about 89 to 90 cents in Canada, it widens for people that are new immigrants, people of other ethnicities. And it’s important to think about this when we think about selecting careers as women. Selecting a career in wealth management because of the compensation structures, reduces the likelihood that there will be a gender pay gap, you’re running an efficient style of business, it’s the same compensation structure, regardless of gender. It is an incredible career to consider for women, for many reasons, but that’s a really important one. And because you have less of a gap… when it comes to pay, you also have more autonomy. So knowing that you control a little bit more of your own destiny, you have the ability to set your own schedule
Sarah Widmeyer 27:54
Mmhmm
Natalie Bisset 27:54
which again, back to what we started our conversation with…
Sarah Widmeyer 27:56
Yeah…
Natalie Bisset 27:56
Caregiving, right. And so my last thought, as I think about this topic overall, and I agree, we could talk about this endlessly because it’s fascinating. But I’d love for women who aren’t already in the industry to consider wealth management. Many, many reasons why the two that I mentioned earlier were this pay gap and the autonomy, the ability to have a type of compensation structure that is very transparent. But I hope that more women get into wealth management. We’re currently sitting between 17 and 20%, depending on the channel that women provide wealth management services. But I’d love to see more women…
Sarah Widmeyer 27:56
Care-caregiving
Natalie Bisset 27:58
And you mentioned it earlier, the importance around a female client and a female advisor as investing partners. Wouldn’t it be amazing to see a larger population there?
Sarah Widmeyer 28:48
Oh, incredibly amazing. And I just think about how, how much good we can all do.
Natalie Bisset 28:55
Yes,
Sarah Widmeyer 28:56
for ourselves in the world around us. Love this topic. Love Natalie, thank you so much for joining us today and sharing your perspective on this monumental wealth shift and what it means for the industry. It’s pretty clear that wealth is rapidly changing hands and it’s time for wealth management to catch up to better understand the mi
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